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'U.S. to collapse within 2 decades'

christarzan — Thu, 09 Oct 2008 07:51:40 +0000

FROM WND

Islamic cleric warns America facing destruction

An Islamic cleric from Lebanon is forecasting the destruction of the United States within 20 years, according to a new report from MEMRI Television.

The Middle East Media Research Institute has posted a video on its website quoting Lebanese Sunni Cleric Sheik Muhammad Abu Al-Qat, who appeared on Al-Manar TV in May.

An Islamic cleric from Lebanon says the United States won't survive beyond two more decades

"Let me bring good tidings to the Muslims," Al-Qat states. "Allah willing, the American empire will very soon collapse."

He explained Americans now "object to any talk about the destruction of the state of Israel. … They are celebrating its 60th anniversary."

Then came his prophecy: "We say that Allah willing, within 20 to 12 years, America will collapse. This won't happen as a result of war. Not at all. Allah will send to America an American Gorbachev, from within. Gorbachev, who brought about the USSR collapse, was one of them.

"Everybody knows this story," he said. "An American Gorbachev will surface in America, and he will destroy this empire."

WND previously reported MEMRI's documentation of Muslim leaders using a children's television program to assure viewers it was proper for thieves to have their hands chopped off.

The report followed MEMRI's feature of a Palestinian show that had President Bush "killed" and a children's Mickey Mouse-lookalike being "martyred" for the Palestinian cause.

MEMRI is an independent nonprofit that provides translations of media reports from the Middle East and analysis.

The organization previously has documented a children's TV show about Nahoul, the bee, weeping over his "martyred" family.

Hamas, which won a majority in parliament in January 2006 elections, officially is considered a terrorist organization by the U.S. government. As WND reported, a prominent Hamas leader was captured on video boasting of using children, women and the elderly as human shields in its firefights with Israeli soldiers.

WND also reported Hamas launched a children's website in 2002 that encourages kids to follow the example of terrorist suicide bombers.

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'U.S. to collapse within 2 decades'

christarzan — Thu, 09 Oct 2008 07:42:26 +0000

FROM WND

Islamic cleric warns America facing destruction

An Islamic cleric from Lebanon is forecasting the destruction of the United States within 20 years, according to a new report from MEMRI Television.

The Middle East Media Research Institute has posted a video on its website quoting Lebanese Sunni Cleric Sheik Muhammad Abu Al-Qat, who appeared on Al-Manar TV in May.

An Islamic cleric from Lebanon says the United States won't survive beyond two more decades

"Let me bring good tidings to the Muslims," Al-Qat states. "Allah willing, the American empire will very soon collapse."

He explained Americans now "object to any talk about the destruction of the state of Israel. … They are celebrating its 60th anniversary."

"Everybody knows this story," he said. "An American Gorbachev will surface in America, and he will destroy this empire."

WND previously reported MEMRI's documentation of Muslim leaders using a children's television program to assure viewers it was proper for thieves to have their hands chopped off.

The report followed MEMRI's feature of a Palestinian show that had President Bush "killed" and a children's Mickey Mouse-lookalike being "martyred" for the Palestinian cause.

MEMRI is an independent nonprofit that provides translations of media reports from the Middle East and analysis.

The organization previously has documented a children's TV show about Nahoul, the bee, weeping over his "martyred" family.

WND also reported Hamas launched a children's website in 2002 that encourages kids to follow the example of terrorist suicide bombers.

Acabou sem pizza

Paulo Renato Souza Cunha — Tue, 07 Oct 2008 22:31:20 +0000

Resolvi esquecer o perfil caçador solitário e voltar para os bedelhos russos. “Nestas estradas que parecem infinitas.” Mas, acalme-se, companheiro. Nada de frase elegante d'um célebre poeta soviético dos 1950. Falo mesmo é de buraco. Se é que podemos chamar isso de buraco.

Pelo visto, há diversos problemas rodoviários na Rússia também. Bastou cair chuva e pronto. Rapazote entregador de pizza (que beleza o automóvel que os russos utilizam para entregar pizza, não?! Muito jeitoso...) nem manjou cratera escondida no meio da rua. Deu no que deu. Carro atolado, cliente insatisfeito, moço sem emprego. Simples assim.

A história é a seguinte. Senhor Mihailovic, búlgaro, mas mora em Moscou há 20 anos, estava com preguiça de preparar acepipes à amante. Sim, amante. Resolveu escolher a opção que 67% dos russos escolhem em ocasiões como esta (amantes com fome): telepizza.

Como podemos ver na foto, a iguaria de calabresa não chegou ao destino final. Pior, Mihailovic, sem muitas opções, desceu para ir ao supermercado comprar batatas (segundo testemunhas, a moça estava com desejo de batatas). Na prateleira à esquerda, adivinha quem o búlgaro encontrou? Se você respondeu Gorbachev, resposta errada.

Ali estava a esposa do sujeito. Com um amante russo! Que coisa maluca. Machista, Mihailovic ficou indignado. “Eu posso, ela não pode.” Uma criança, praticamente.

O desfecho deste conto é previsível. Divórcio e processo. Mihailovic quer 20 milhões de rublos da pizzaria por danos morais. “E o pobre entregador?”, deve estar se perguntando. Igor Romanovic enviou currículo ao McDonald’s e garantiu: “Agora, só ando de moto.”

Ronald Reagan speech to Gorbachev 1987

stuckinthe80s — Tue, 07 Oct 2008 07:40:06 +0000

From the famous speech American President Ronald Reagan gave at East Berlin in 1987, commanding USSR President Mikhail Gorbachev to "Tear Down This Wall!"

The reunification fo Germany brought prosperity and capitalism to East Germany, along with opportunity for citizens oppressed for decades. It also resulted in a stronger, more powerful economy for the now larger country of Germany.

Another Attempt at Resuscitating Democracy

Russia Profile — Wed, 01 Oct 2008 09:07:56 +0000

Former Soviet President Mikhail Gorbachev and billionaire banker Alexander Lebedev have announced the formation of a new opposition party. Its organizers say the new party, to be called the Independent Democratic Party of Russia, will run on a social democratic platform and make its debut in the 2011 Duma elections.
More
RP

There You Go Again, McCain

Esmé Pestel — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 06:05:36 +0000

Insert Pun About Mastery of Debate Here

In case I don't post anything longer about it, here are a couple quick notes on the presidential debate, most of them in reference to errors or distortions, historical or otherwise, that McCain made:

-Claim: Reagan refused to meet Soviet leaders with no preconditions and it took Gorbachev's glastnost and perestroika reforms for Reagan to finally have talks.
When Reagan was recuperating in the hospital following his assassination attempt, he wrote a letter to Brezhnev suggesting they meet and directed Alexander Haig to send it along. Haig read it and said something to the effect of "This isn't our policy." Reagan, a bit taken aback, smiled and replied "Well, it's my policy!" Eventually, it was sent along, but Brezhnev, who by this time had already been revived from death more than once and who had long since left most of the duties of running the government to Andropov and others, unsurprisingly declined. After Brezhnev kicked the bucket, Andropov got his turn running the USSR and Reagan tried again. No luck, Andropov died of kidney disease shortly into his term and was followed by Chernenko. Again, Reagan tried. Again, the Soviet leader died fairly quickly. Gorbachev came to power in 1985. Reagan met him in 1985. This is what's called "The Geneva Summit." This occurred before most of Gorbachev's reforms got off the ground. McCain's claim is patently false.

-Claim: Pakistan was a failed state when Musharraf's coup overthrew the democracy.
Well...highly corrupt, yes, but a failed state? This characterization usually applies to countries like Afghanistan and Somalia. Pakistan was nowhere near as bad off as either of those - indeed, there basically is no state power in either Afghanistan or Somalia. Is this a more subjective criticism? Certainly, since it depends on one's definition of a failed state. But I still think it's salient.

-Not exactly a claim, but: McCain expressing disbelief at Obama's claim that Ahmadinejad is not the most powerful person in Iran. Obama is right, Ahmadinejad is not the most powerful person in Iran. Ayatollah Khamenei is. The Ayatollah controls foreign and nuclear policy, and can fire Ahmadinejad at any time he wishes. True, the fact that he hasn't fired him may mean he approves of what he is saying. But the fact that he also hasn't thrown Ahmadinejad's more pragmatic or centrist opponents out of parliament suggests to me that he probably doesn't have strong opinions on it either way. Despite all Ahmadinejad's raving about Israel (perhaps he actually believes what he says, perhaps he's just appeasing his base, or both), all he really controls is domestic policy. Khamenei has been in power since Ayatollah Khomeini, modern Iran's founder, died - he's a smooth political operator, and although its certainly possible they are developing nuclear weapons, I find it hard to believe Khamenei would ever use them.
This, however, is a more nebulous issue. Although I don't think Iran possessing nukes presents an existential threat to Israel (mostly because if they ever used them it would mean Iran's utter annihilation, and they know that), I can see the argument of Israel: the last time some idiot was raving about how Jews needed to be destroyed, he actually followed through with it. For them, it's a risk they simply can't take. Ultimately, I don't know where I stand on Iran's nuclear program - but I think that it would behoove our next president to know who the person who really pulls all the strings in Iran is; that is, Ayatollah Khamenei. And it doesn't help that we give a free pass to Israel on everything, including their foot dragging on all things Palestine related.

A slap on the wrist for both Obama and McCain for perpetuating a fairly flawed view of the Russia-Georgia war. Yes, Russia was provoking the hell out of Georgia for months by issuing Russian passports to citizens of Abkhazia and South Ossetia, among other things. Yes, Russia has always been sort of an asshole to the more independent minded former Soviet Republics that ring it. For further evidence, see their support of Moldova's breakaway republic Trandniestria, their treatment of Estonia, and their generally obstreperous behavior towards anyone that does not toe the Moscow line. But the fact is, the two breakaway regions in Georgia had been de facto independent since the early 1990's. Georgia was the one who started the conflict by trying to reassert control over these areas, neither of which even want to be a part of Georgia or are majority ethnic Georgian.

But an extra slap on the wrist for McCain and his league of democracies idea. Such a league would of course exclude corrupt or highly restrictive democracies like Russia, Venezuela, and Iran, but also democracies that are technically squeaky clean but we find distasteful because of their opposition to the US, like Bolivia and Ecuador, or their authoritarian but otherwise legitimate nature, like Singapore. And, of course, it would include our little friend Georgia. For the same reason that Georgia should not join NATO, they shouldn't join a league of democracies. You never, never want to be obligated or expected to help an ally who has pervasive territorial conflicts. But even aside from that, a league of democracies would make the UN even more irrelevant than it already is, insulate the US, and discourage diplomacy with countries. You don't have to be an idealist to believe that diplomacy can solve problems. Isolating ourselves from the parts of the world that we dislike will not be productive in the least.

P.S. Didn't feel like footnoting this whole thing, but if anyone wants the bibliography I'll post it as a comment.

Väst måste sluta att spela översittare mot Ryssland

janoberg — Wed, 17 Sep 2008 07:36:50 +0000

År 1994 ingick jag i en faktasamlande grupp utsänd av TFF till Georgien, Sydossetien och Abchazien. Att 8 augustikriget skulle bryta ut kändes mycket möjligt att förutsäga, om än inte den exakta tidpunkten.

Man kan lätt inse detta om man börjar med att se på den bredare, globala tidsramen, på konfliktformationen och inte bara kriget och går tillbaka ungefär 20 år i tiden.

Låt oss alltså titta på hur framgångsrik Västvärlden egentligen var med den förfärliga Sovjetunionens upplösning under överinseende av ett visionärt ledarskap av en man som vi fortfarande borde känna djup tacksamhet mot, nämligen Michail Sergejevitj Gorbatjov.

År 1989 drog sig Gorbatjov tillbaka från Afghanistan och frigav Sacharov. I Väst blev det ingen reaktion. Hela hans förändringsfilosofi berövade Västvärlden dess älskade fiende.
Gorbatjov föreslog därefter en helt ny säkerhetsstruktur, ett ”europeiskt hus” med OSSE och FN som främsta byggstenar. Det triumferande Väst brydde sig inte om det.
Gorbatjov bad om ekonomiskt stöd i Väst för sina utspel om perestrojka och glasnost i avsikt att skapa vad som skulle ha blivit ett öppet socialdemokratiskt inspirerat samhälle. G7-gruppen beslutade sig för att ignorera hans begäran och satsade på Jeltsin, en populist utan liknande visioner eller karisma.

Västvärlden ville begripligt nog förena Tyskland, men detta representerade av historiska skäl ett stort hot i ryssarnas ögon. Ryssland fick dock löfte om att Nato inte skulle utvidgas.
Warszawa-pakten upplöstes, men Nato blev kvar och trots löften om motsatsen utvidgades alliansen snabbt. Dessutom fortsatte Nato med att hävda rätten att använda kärnvapen som den första, även mot ett konventionellt angrepp.

Clinton-administrationen inledde 1992 ett jättelikt amerikanskt militärt expansionsprogram. I Östeuropa, inbegripet Jugoslavien, och runt om hela Ryssland byggde USA baser, placerade ut rådgivare och infiltrerade ministerier med 'rådgivare' och folk från vinningslystna bolag. Rysslands protester mot hela denna satsning i dess ”nära utland” brydde man sig inte om.

Serber placerades i rollen som de eviga och enda strykpojkarna i 90-talets jugoslaviska krig – som Jugoslaviens ryssar – expansionistiska och farliga vis-à-vis små och påstått frihetsälskande och demokratiska aktörer som Kroatiens Franjo Tudjman, Bosniens Alija Izetbegovic moch Kosovos Agim Ceku.

Natos bombningar av Serbien och Kosovo kränkte all folkrätt, de skedde utan mandat från FN:s säkerhetsråd och lämnade efter sig ett land förstört i grunden. Ryska argument för en förhandlingslösning brydde man sig inte om.

Ett ballistiskt robotförsvar (BMD) ser vi nu också påbjudas; det är inte alls är ett defensivt system utan ett som i stället syftar till att säkra att USA:s territorium skyddas mot vedergällning om USA inleder ett kärnvapenangrepp mot ett annat land. Ryssland tycker att det är en dålig idé – lika dålig som ett liknande system skulle verka för amerikanerna om det upprättades av ryssarna på andra sidan gränsen i Mexico.

Som en uppvisning i respekt för demokrati har en sådan uppgörelse träffats med Polen trots att hela 90% av folket är emot att BMD placeras ut på deras territorium. Den ryska oron för systemet ignoreras gång på gång. Det heter att systemet ska skydda oss mot skurkaktörer som Teheran, men när Moskva erbjöd sig att bereda plats för BMD på sitt territorium närmare Iran, tackade USA nej till erbjudandet och bekräftade därmed vad Ryssland fruktade, nämligen att BMD i själva verket är riktat mot Ryssland i stället. Ryssarna tycks inte förstå hur vi i väst lyckas uppfinna hot…

I år beslutade så USA och de flesta av EU:s medlemsstater att Kosovo ska vara en oberoende stat. Alla substantiella ryska argument för en framförhandlad kompromiss och förutsägelser om att ett avskiljande stimulerar avskiljanden på annat håll ignorerades - återigen.

Ryssland ses alltmer som det stora nya hotet mot vilket Nato ska skydda oss, trots att Ryssland har militärutgifter som ligger på i runda tal 5 procent av Natos, 7 procent av Förenta staternas och 13 procent av EU:s.

USA:s strategi och intressen

Hur kommer då Georgien in i allt detta?

Redan 1994 fick jag höra när jag besökte USA-kontor i Tblisi att denna kaukasiska stat intog en framskjuten position i USA:s strategi och intressen i området. Georgiska tjänsteman sade samtidigt till mig att de bara väntade på att Georgien skulle bli valt som värdland för de väldiga olje- och gasledningarna och att Georgien sedan skulle bli en regional makt att räkna med.

USA har sedan dess genomfört en rad omfattande program för utbildning och utrustning som organiserats av Pentagon, USA:s Specialstyrkor och USA:s Marinkår och Georgien blev 2004 medlem av Natos Partnerskap för fred. Man kan också i förbigående nämna något som ofta glöms bort i alla diskussioner om Georgiens försvar, nämligen Israels ansenliga militära stöd till Georgien och det faktum att Georgiens försvarsminister Davit Kezerashvili är före detta israel med nära förbindelser till Israels försvarsindustri.

Trots att Georgien är ett land i djup fattigdom, är landets militärutgifter ansenliga. I slutet av juni ökade den georgiska regeringen försvarsministeriets budget på 513 miljoner lari (315 miljoner US$ ) med 442 miljoner lari (260 miljoner US$) enligt Institute for War and Peace Reporting i mitten av 2007.

Enligt Stockholm International Peace Research Institute, SIPRI, har Georgien för närvarande världens högsta genomsnittliga tillväxttakt när det gäller militärutgifter. Några oberoende experter oroar sig för att utgifterna inte är fullständigt redovisade, medan andra säger att detta skulle kunna undergräva fredsprocesserna med utbrytarterritorierna Abchazien och Sydossetien.
Georgiens militärbudget ökade till det 50-dubbla under perioden från 2002 (18 miljoner US$) till 2008 (900 miljoner US$) och nådde nästan nio procent av Georgiens BNP.

Georgien är en mycket lojal partner i USA:s krig mot terrorismen, är också den tredje största ockupationsstyrkan i Irak, är närvarande även i Afghanistan och har varit i Kosovo. Det skulle vara naivt att tro att Georgiens president Mikheil Saakashvili inte hade grönt ljus från Washington när han anföll Sydossetien.

Ta hänsyn till historien

Denna region är lika komplicerad som det före detta Jugoslavien, med lika mycket historia av trauman, etniska gräl, minoriteter inom minoriteter, ekonomiska och konstitutionella kriser och korruption. Framtiden är dyster för oss alla om krig liknande de på Balkan under 90-talet skulle bryta ut i Kaukasus än en gång och dra in Ryssland och Europa. Dyster, vill säga, såvida inte någon stannar upp och börjar tänka i stället för enbart reagera och rättfärdiga sitt eget deltagande i det trista militaristiska och maktpolitiska spelet.

För att desarmera denna kris, måste man:

- först åtminstone något beakta historien;
- därpå visa någon liten empati med de agerande som inte är USA eller EU;
- erkänna att Västvärldens agerande inte alltid har oskyldiga konsekvenser;
- inse det ytterligt kontraproduktiva i militariseringen och dess psyko-politiska verkningar;

Dessutom skulle det vara till hjälp om Västvärldens tongivande massmedier upphörde med att återanvända det kalla krigets stereotyper om ett evigt aggressivt Ryssland och med att på Pravda-vis bara återge vad Västvärldens militaristiska eliter säger.

Konsten att avläsa och ställa bra frågor borde återkomma i internationell journalistik och i utrikespolitiska reportage och frigöra journalistyrket från medbrottslighet i varje framtida krig i regionen – ett krig som med säkerhet skulle bli mycket mer omfattande än vi har sett hittills.
Framför allt måste vi komma ihåg att förhandlingar är vida överlägsna hotelser och framkallande av fruktan.

Ryssarna har nu sagt: Hit, men inte längre. Det skulle vara klokt av Västvärlden att lyssna till varningen. Det ligger inte i Västvärldens eget bästa intresse att fortsätta att spela översittare mot och förödmjuka Ryssland. För sådant har Ryssland allt för mycket kultur, historia, värdighet och resurser…

Översatt från engelska av Erik Göthe.

* På engelska här

JO # 1217

Alien Nation, Gorbachev, and Scrambled Eggs

fofobeeto — Tue, 16 Sep 2008 21:36:32 +0000

"Cooked in the pan is overcooked on the plate." --Alton Brown On Eggs

While I don't fault my parents for my hatred of that insipid lip adornment, I am embittered about the part they've played in my current predisposition to the possibility of salmonella poisoning. Can't you get salmonella from undercooked eggs?

It happened like this: my parents were all about family dining. My mom cooked most of the time, but my dad would cook on the weekends. My dad burned the eggs. This was before the cancerous non-stick teflon era, so burned eggs looked different then, than they do now. They looked like Gorbachev's birthmark.

And you can see that this really affected me at a formative age because of my reference to Mr. Gorbachev.

I think Gorbacheve and Noriega were the only foreign names I knew back then. Them, and Alien Nation.

So Dad, stop burning eggs.

The eggs would be yellow, as eggs are, but with a brown burn pattern that looked like I was eating the skin of an alien detective from TV. Who wants to eat that? And who wants to eat ANY part of Mr. Gorbachev?

I have to go.

Did Gorbachev Do Gobachop ?

alieninliberia — Mon, 15 Sep 2008 11:52:37 +0000

I must admit to my shame that I only learned the word from a newspaper. Obviously it has been around for a long time, but since Liberians are polite people, and prefer to gloss over things that are wrong, nobody has mentioned it to me yet. While it looks like a noun it is actually a verb. Declination follows relaxes Liberian rules. "I gobachop - You gopachop - He gobachop - We/They gobachop". And it is a very practical word indeed, since it summarily describes many of the unlawful yet frequent activities happening in Liberia. It can be used to denote stealing, extorting bribes, misappropriating funds, in short a wide variety of misdeeds. According to my source, the large outdoor market at Red Light Junction is also know to the locals as "gobachop" market.
And I had barely mastered the word, when on Saturday morning I was treated to a demonstration of it. A policeman standing on the side of the road waved me over, after I just had dropped a passenger, and insisted that I had stopped in a "no stopping zone". He also referred to a no stopping sign somewhere up the road, but I am no sure if the sign exists in reality or only in his imagination. Then he told me that since I had committed the heinous crime of stopping in a zone where no one except thousands of taxis stop daily, he would have to take my car to "Central", the headquarters of the Liberia National Police. I politely asked him to get in the car, fasten his seat belt and then inquired which direction I should take, and that I was glad to go with him to Central, to take the matter up with the Police Commissioner over there. He suddenly seemed a little less cocky and pointed vaguely forward, incidentally straight away from Central. I told him I needed to turn right to Freeport, not straight. He replied that I could set him down a little down the street, which I did. Now, there was an attempted "gobachop" in all its glory.
And as for the former Soviet President, he most likely did not "gobachop". In Yeltsin´s case however, I am not so sure.

World Illusions 9-8-08

Stefan Fobes — Mon, 08 Sep 2008 19:57:26 +0000

Under the skin diabetes monitor boosts diabetes control

Liquid bomb "mastermind" Abdul Ahmed Ali and two others found guilty of conspiracy to murder - That's the government's side of the story, basically. Jury didn't completely buy the UK gov's side of the story though.

Liquid bomb Pakistan link is smoking gun - And the "conspiracy theorist's" side of the story. Rightfully asks the question why, if mixing liquids is so dangerous, are people ordered to dump all their liquids in one trashcan before boarding planes??

Gorbachev says NATO growth aimed at isolating Russia

Russia confirms they're participating in a joint naval exercise in the Caribbean with Venezuela in November

Murdoch's Russia-based advertising group says office searched

Close to 100 more Afghans killed in airstrike than the US said

Russians turn back naval convoy and ambassadors inside Georgia

High ranking Scientologists charged with fraud in France - They could be stopped from operating in France if found guilty. This made my day!

Brazil and Argentina to drop dollar for bilateral trade

Ronald Reagan - Mr. Gorbachev, Tear Down This Wall !

greatspeeches — Sun, 31 Aug 2008 13:05:38 +0000

Excerpt from the speech - 4:00min.

Full speech:American Rhetoric, Audio mp3 of Address

Peace Nobel Price winner Gorbachev "Russia never wanted a war"

Holger Roehlig — Sat, 23 Aug 2008 13:45:44 +0000

Former president of the Soviet Union Gorbachev in the New York Times, published: August 19, 2008:

"THE acute phase of the crisis provoked by the Georgian forces’ assault on Tskhinvali, the capital of South Ossetia, is now behind us. But how can one erase from memory the horrifying scenes of the nighttime rocket attack on a peaceful town, the razing of entire city blocks, the deaths of people taking cover in basements, the destruction of ancient monuments and ancestral graves?

Russia did not want this crisis. The Russian leadership is in a strong enough position domestically; it did not need a little victorious war. Russia was dragged into the fray by the recklessness of the Georgian president, Mikheil Saakashvili. He would not have dared to attack without outside support. Once he did, Russia could not afford inaction.

...

The planners of this campaign clearly wanted to make sure that, whatever the outcome, Russia would be blamed for worsening the situation. The West then mounted a propaganda attack against Russia[...]

The news coverage has been far from fair and balanced, especially during the first days of the crisis. Tskhinvali was in smoking ruins and thousands of people were fleeing — before any Russian troops arrived."

Voices Of Reason

enjameel — Fri, 22 Aug 2008 12:36:47 +0000

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/20/opinion/20gorbachev.html?_r=2&scp=2&sq=gorbachev&st=cse&oref=slogin&oref=slogin

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_Study_Group

It's a strange world where James Baker and Gorbachev are the calm voices of reason.

War in the Caucasus, Commonsensically Considered

js81 — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 23:46:08 +0000

It occurs to me that former Soviet president Mikhail Gorbachev, making his case regarding Russia's recent war with Georgia in the New York Times, was merely exorcising the demons of his failure to prevent the breakup of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, of which Georgia and the lands now in question - South Ossetia and Abkhazia - were once a part. I do not doubt for a second Mr. Gorbachev's genuine sense of Russian nationalism, nor, being an American patriot myself, can I fault him for it. However, with his words we are obviously getting only one side of the story, and it is certainly not from the viewpoint of the outnumbered underdog, Georgia.

Where are the op-eds from, and not just about, President Saakashvili of Georgia? A pity, it is, that we haven't seen any yet.

Was the President of Georgia wrong to "invade" Georgian territory with Georgian troops? Well, perhaps he could have gone about bringing South Ossetia and Abkhazia back under the rule of Tbilisi in a different way. But isn't it hypocritical for Mr. Gorbachev, unapologetic Russian nationalist, to criticize Mr. Saakashvili for seeking to retake rebellious provinces by force, when both Boris Yeltsin - with disastrous results - and Vladimir Putin - victoriously - attempted to, with force, bring Chechnya back under the rule of Moscow? Don't forget: Back then, Russia told the West that the Chechnyan war was an internal matter, concerning only Russian sovereignty.

How, then, are South Ossetia and Abkhazia any different, with regards to Georgian sovereignty?

Georgian sovereignty isn't being questioned by the Free World. But the Russian Federation's use of an internal Georgian territorial dispute as a pretext for launching an illegal invasion and occupation of Georgian territory shows that if anyone in power today questions Georgia's right to independence and full sovereignty, they work and rule from Moscow's Kremlin. Georgia's military campaign had not as its aim the dissolution of the Russian state; President Saakashvili was merely trying to fulfill a campaign promise he'd previously made to those who elected him to high office, to return to Georgia what he claims rightfully belong to Georgia.

Of course, the nature of Georgia's government would have made it nearly impossible for Tbilisi to continue to hold onto South Ossetia, and Abkhazia later, by use of force and manipulation alone had President Saakashvili achieved his aims. But while Russia's brutality in rebellious Chechnya might have shocked the sensibilities of the civilized masses of the West, given the nature of Russia's government, and that nation's domestically-violent history, did such a callous disregard for human decency on the part of Russia, so effective in bringing Chechnya back nominally under Moscow's iron-fist rule, really come as a surprise to anyone? I should think not.

So by that measure, President Saakashvili was wrong to invade South Ossetia - but his was a lapse of judgment or timing, not morality. However, Russia has been far more wrong to interfere as it has in Georgian affairs, by recognizing de facto Ossetian and Abkhazian independence, and/or granting Russian citizenship and passports to those regions' residents. When one considers such meddlesome Russian activities, coupled with Moscow's late military expansionism in Georgia, with the faculty of common sense, he or she might find it very difficult to sympathize with the arguments on behalf of Russia made by Mikhail Gorbachev.

But then...how prevalent amongst the masses - in any country - is common sense today?

Gorbachev: Russia Never Wanted a War with Georgia

disaphorism — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 13:42:09 +0000

Mikhail Gorbachev, writing an op-ed for NYT, argues the point.

Russia did not want this crisis. The Russian leadership is in a strong enough position domestically; it did not need a little victorious war. Russia was dragged into the fray by the recklessness of the Georgian president, Mikheil Saakashvili. He would not have dared to attack without outside support. Once he did, Russia could not afford inaction.

...

What is needed is a legally binding agreement not to use force. Mr. Saakashvili has repeatedly refused to sign such an agreement, for reasons that have now become abundantly clear.

...

Indeed, Russia has long been told to simply accept the facts. Here’s the independence of Kosovo for you. Here’s the abrogation of the Antiballistic Missile Treaty, and the American decision to place missile defenses in neighboring countries. Here’s the unending expansion of NATO. All of these moves have been set against the backdrop of sweet talk about partnership. Why would anyone put up with such a charade?

Russia Never Wanted a War

anthony — Wed, 20 Aug 2008 11:56:49 +0000

By MIKHAIL GORBACHEV | NYT | Published: August 19, 2008

THE acute phase of the crisis provoked by the Georgian forces’ assault on Tskhinvali, the capital of South Ossetia, is now behind us. But how can one erase from memory the horrifying scenes of the nighttime rocket attack on a peaceful town, the razing of entire city blocks, the deaths of people taking cover in basements, the destruction of ancient monuments and ancestral graves?

The decision by the Russian president, Dmitri Medvedev, to now cease hostilities was the right move by a responsible leader. The Russian president acted calmly, confidently and firmly. Anyone who expected confusion in Moscow was disappointed.

The planners of this campaign clearly wanted to make sure that, whatever the outcome, Russia would be blamed for worsening the situation. The West then mounted a propaganda attack against Russia, with the American news media leading the way.

The news coverage has been far from fair and balanced, especially during the first days of the crisis. Tskhinvali was in smoking ruins and thousands of people were fleeing — before any Russian troops arrived. Yet Russia was already being accused of aggression; news reports were often an embarrassing recitation of the Georgian leader’s deceptive statements.

It is still not quite clear whether the West was aware of Mr. Saakashvili’s plans to invade South Ossetia, and this is a serious matter. What is clear is that Western assistance in training Georgian troops and shipping large supplies of arms had been pushing the region toward war rather than peace.

If this military misadventure was a surprise for the Georgian leader’s foreign patrons, so much the worse. It looks like a classic wag-the-dog story.

Mr. Saakashvili had been lavished with praise for being a staunch American ally and a real democrat — and for helping out in Iraq. Now America’s friend has wrought disorder, and all of us — the Europeans and, most important, the region’s innocent civilians — must pick up the pieces.

Those who rush to judgment on what’s happening in the Caucasus, or those who seek influence there, should first have at least some idea of this region’s complexities. The Ossetians live both in Georgia and in Russia. The region is a patchwork of ethnic groups living in close proximity. Therefore, all talk of “this is our land,” “we are liberating our land,” is meaningless. We must think about the people who live on the land.

The problems of the Caucasus region cannot be solved by force. That has been tried more than once in the past two decades, and it has always boomeranged.

What is needed is a legally binding agreement not to use force. Mr. Saakashvili has repeatedly refused to sign such an agreement, for reasons that have now become abundantly clear.

The West would be wise to help achieve such an agreement now. If, instead, it chooses to blame Russia and re-arm Georgia, as American officials are suggesting, a new crisis will be inevitable. In that case, expect the worst.

In recent days, Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice and President Bush have been promising to isolate Russia. Some American politicians have threatened to expel it from the Group of 8 industrialized nations, to abolish the NATO-Russia Council and to keep Russia out of the World Trade Organization.

These are empty threats. For some time now, Russians have been wondering: If our opinion counts for nothing in those institutions, do we really need them? Just to sit at the nicely set dinner table and listen to lectures?

There is much talk now in the United States about rethinking relations with Russia. One thing that should definitely be rethought: the habit of talking to Russia in a condescending way, without regard for its positions and interests.

Our two countries could develop a serious agenda for genuine, rather than token, cooperation. Many Americans, as well as Russians, understand the need for this. But is the same true of the political leaders?

A bipartisan commission led by Senator Chuck Hagel and former Senator Gary Hart has recently been established at Harvard to report on American-Russian relations to Congress and the next president. It includes serious people, and, judging by the commission’s early statements, its members understand the importance of Russia and the importance of constructive bilateral relations.

But the members of this commission should be careful. Their mandate is to present “policy recommendations for a new administration to advance America’s national interests in relations with Russia.” If that alone is the goal, then I doubt that much good will come out of it. If, however, the commission is ready to also consider the interests of the other side and of common security, it may actually help rebuild trust between Russia and the United States and allow them to start doing useful work together.

Mikhail Gorbachev is the former president of the Soviet Union. This article was translated by Pavel Palazhchenko from the Russian.

Russia Never Wanted a War

anthony — Wed, 20 Aug 2008 11:55:58 +0000

anthony @ 12:55 BST

By MIKHAIL GORBACHEV | NYT | Published: August 19, 2008

If this military misadventure was a surprise for the Georgian leader’s foreign patrons, so much the worse. It looks like a classic wag-the-dog story.

The problems of the Caucasus region cannot be solved by force. That has been tried more than once in the past two decades, and it has always boomeranged.

What is needed is a legally binding agreement not to use force. Mr. Saakashvili has repeatedly refused to sign such an agreement, for reasons that have now become abundantly clear.

Mikhail Gorbachev is the former president of the Soviet Union. This article was translated by Pavel Palazhchenko from the Russian.

Informationskrieg: CNN Interview mit Gorbatschow

satyamandira — Mon, 18 Aug 2008 22:38:37 +0000

(vom August 14, 2008 )
Gorbatschow sagte u.a.:

"... Ich weiß nicht, warum es so präsentiert wird, dass Russland in Georgien eingedrungen ist. Das ist wirklich Disinformation. Das sind alles Lügen. Es bedeutet, dass dieser Plan - es gab einen Plan Ossetien anzugreifen und ebenso die Menschen zu missinformieren - also eine Art Informationskrieg. ..."

(Übersetzung von der Englischen CNN Übersetzung)

[siehe auch vorhergehenden Artikel von dorolando ]

Das erinnert mich an die Aussage von jemanden, der meinte, dass Gorbatschow einfach nur dumm sei. Nun vielleicht redet er hier aus taktischen Gründen nicht über den Grund der Desinformation. Ansonsten müßte man ihm dringend empfehlen "The Grand Chessboard" (auf deutsch: "Die einzige Weltmacht") von Zbigniew Brzezinski zu lesen (Zitate daraus hier: http://www.wanttoknow.info/brzezinskigrandchessboard )

Zum Kaukasus schreibt er:

"It follows that America's primary interest is to help ensure that no single power comes to control this geopolitical space and that the global community has unhindered financial and economic access to it."
(S. 148 )
[auf deutsch: “Amerikas primäres Interesse muß folglich sein, mit dafür zu sorgen, daß keine einzelne Macht die Kontrolle über dieses Gebiet erlangt und die Weltgemeinschaft ungehinderten finanziellen und wirtschaftlichen Zugang zu ihr hat.”]

Weltgemeinschaft versteht sich selbstverständlich unter der Führung der USA ;-)

Mehr bei weissganix.de in dem Artikel: Zbiggi über Georgien

Ja nu hat unsere Kanzlerin Georgien bereits einen Natobeitritt versprochen ("Georgien wird, wenn es will und das will es ja, Mitglied der Nato sein.") und den Abwehrraketen in Polen wurde nun noch schneller zugestimmt.
Da haben se nu wohl einiges zu Schlucken, die Russen.

Hier nun das Interview:

http://de.youtube.com/watch?v=nSd_FNhZEZs
http://edition.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/europe/08/14/gorbachev/index.html#cnnSTCVideo

http://de.youtube.com/watch?v=mZNjKMS6onc

Gorbachev: Georgia started conflict in S. Ossetia

(CNN) -- Georgian leaders may be blaming Russia for the conflict raging in South Ossetia, but former Soviet President Mikhail Gorbachev said Thursday "there is no doubt" that Georgia provoked the clash.

Gorbachev told CNN's Larry King that Russia moved additional forces into South Ossetia in response to "devastation" in the South Ossetia city of Tskhinvali.

"This was the use of sophisticated weapons against a small town, against a sleeping people. This was a barbaric assault," said Gorbachev, the last president of the former Soviet Union.

But Georgian President Mikheil Saakashvili, who also appeared on CNN's "Larry King Live" Thursday, said he was "profoundly shocked" that Mikhail Gorbachev would use a television appearance "for basically vindicating lies and deceptions."

Last week, Georgia said it launched an operation into South Ossetia after a cease-fire was broken with artillery fire from Russian separatists that killed 10 people including civilians and peacekeepers. It accused Russia, which also has peacekeepers in the region, of backing the separatists.

Hours later, the Russian news agency Interfax reported that Russian authorities said 10 Russian peacekeepers had been killed and 30 wounded in an attack by Georgians.

"Western television didn't show what happened in Tskhinvali," Gorbachev said. "Only now they're beginning to show some pictures of the destruction. So this looks to me like it was a well-prepared project. And with any outcome, they wanted to put the blame on Russia."

He called Georgia's claims that Russia is attempting to dismantle its democracy "all lies from beginning to end."

In response, Saakashvili expressed disappointment with the sentiments from Gorbachev, who he said he once respected.

"This is the man, Mr. Gorbachev, who helped to, you know, bring down KGB kingdom. And he is the one who is, you know, justifying what the KGB people are doing right now in my country," Saakashvili said.

"Shame on him. Shame on you, Mr. Gorbachev, for perpetuating the very regime you helped to defeat and you fought against as the head of the Soviet Union."

Gorbachev also said the United States is jeopardizing its fragile relationship with Russia by backing Georgia.

"There is a chance for our two countries to develop a new agenda for cooperation so as to promote both U.S. and Russia interests, and the interests of other countries, and the interests of stability, particularly in the hotspots in different continents," said Gorbachev, who won the Nobel Peace Price in 1990.

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/europe/08/14/gorbachev/index.html#cnnSTCText

[caption id="" align="alignnone" width="517" caption="Ethno Linguistische Karte vom Kaukasus (Wikipedia)"][/caption]

Sashashvili

detainthis — Mon, 18 Aug 2008 05:13:01 +0000

If you have 20–25 minutes to blow, watch these three videos in order. You'll see why Russians infuse the sirname of Georgian president, Mikheil Saakashvili, with a Russian word of significant meaning.

Mikhail Gorbachev, interviewed by Larry King:

M.G.-L.K. continued:

Saakashvili's response:

Sashashvili.*

* - 6:30 mark.

Oh, What a Lovely Neocon War!

anthony — Sun, 17 Aug 2008 12:06:32 +0000

There are two sides to every story, and the Western media has been showing the Georgian side, while ignoring that the NATO/Israeli backed georgians started this war with atrocities committed against ethnic Russians in the breakaway province of Ossetia. Here are some articles giving the "other side of the story" by paleoconservative, Patrick J. Buchanan, former Reagan official, Paul Craig Roberts, liberal commentator, Bill Boyarsky of Truth Dig, and former Soviet president, Mikhail Gorbachev speaking on Russia Today. I've also included a video of the moving final scene of the Attenborough film, Oh, What a Lovely War!

Bear-Baiting Blowback

Patrick J. Buchanan | Taki’s magazine | August 15, 2008

Mikheil Saakashvili’s decision to use the opening of the Olympic Games to cover Georgia’s invasion of its breakaway province of South Ossetia must rank in stupidity with Gamal Abdel-Nasser’s decision to close the Straits of Tiran to Israeli ships.

Gorbachev: ‘Signs of a Cold War Are Present’

Former Soviet President Mikhail Gorbachev appeared on “Larry King Live” Thursday to give his read on the Georgia-Russia conflict, asserting that Georgia was definitively the first to attack, in “a barbaric assault” on Tskhinvali, and that “there was support and protection” for Georgian President Mikheil Saakashvili from … elsewhere in the world.

Former Reagan Official: White House Sanctioned Georgia-Russia Conflict

Paul Craig Roberts, who was assistant secretary of the treasury during Ronald Reagan’s presidency, sees the Georgia-Russia conflict differently than the Bush administration does: “Americans themselves have nothing to gain,” Roberts said Friday; “What is operating is the dangerous ideology of the American neoconservatives whose goal is to assert American hegemony over the entire world.”

Gorbachev: ‘Signs of a Cold War Are Present’

anthony — Sun, 17 Aug 2008 10:55:31 +0000

Update: Saakashvili responded to Gorbachev on King’s show (see below).

Click here to read CNN’s rush transcript of the interview.

Part 1:

Part 2:

Saakashvili slams Gorbachev:

La Georgia ha utilizzato mercenari americani e ucraini

Antonio Ramone — Fri, 15 Aug 2008 23:43:50 +0000

Il presidente dell'ossezia del sud Eduard Kokoity ha dichiarato che Il criminale di guerra Shakasvili ha utilizzato macellai professionisti americani e ucraini nel tentativo fallito di pulizia etnica nell'ossezia del sud dell'8 agosto scorso conclusosi con un bilancio di circa 2.000 vittime quasi tutte civili.

Il presidente Bagapsh dell'Abkhazia ha accusato i media occidentali di fare disinformazione nei confronti dei tragici eventi occorsi durante l'invasione "E' stata un'azione ben preparata,la propaganda occidentale ha fatto un fronte unico pubblicando esclusivamente comunicati e articoli filoamericani"

il presidente ha aggiunto che solo la Spagna,Francia e Germania si sono opposte a questa campagna di disinformazione statunitense.

Michail Sergeevič Gorbačëv , ultimo segretario generale PCUS, ha difeso in maniera incodizionata l'azione russa di peacekeeping in territorio osseto. L'ex segretario generale e Presidente dell'URSS ha ricordato che la Georgia ha un budget di spesa militare di 1 miliardo di dollari interamente finzanziato dal governo USA.